During a tense Oval Office exchange in September, President Donald Trump didn’t mince words for ABC News Chief Washington Correspondent Jonathan Karl.
“ABC is a terrible network, a very unfair network, and you should be ashamed of yourself,” Trump told Karl. “Frankly, you’re a terrible reporter. You know it, and so do I.”
Karl had asked Trump a question about free speech, which sparked the president’s criticism—and a chance to brag about ABC’s public apology and $16 million payment to settle a defamation case with Trump.
“For you to stand there and act so innocent and ask me a question like that,” Trump replied to Karl. “But look, you paid a big price because you were dishonest, Jon. The reason I won that lawsuit was because you were dishonest.”
Karl, who has known and covered Trump for over 30 years, described the encounter during a Daily Signal interview Thursday. He also shared what happened after the camera were off and the president had a private moment with the reporter.
“I said to him, ‘That was pretty tough, mean, with the live cameras going,” Karl recalled. “And he said, ‘No, you were tough on me.’ And he starts laughing. And so, even when he’s really gone after me, it doesn’t last long.”
Karl is the author of a new bestseller, “Retribution: Donald Trump and the Campaign That Changed America,” which offers the reporter’s behind-the-scenes insights into the 2024 presidential campaign.
Karl’s three-decade relationship with Trump, which began when he was a young reporter at the New York Post in 1994, provided him with a unique perspective—and direct access to the president.
Despite their well-documented public sparring matches, Karl revealed a more nuanced dynamic when he’s one on one with Trump. In the book, Karl wrote about a call he placed to Trump following the Butler, Pennsylvania, assassination attempt.
The audio version of Karl’s book even includes real-life audio from his phone calls with Trump, Hunter Biden, and Steve Bannon.
Comparing him to other presidents he’s covered, Karl highlighted Trump’s unique ability to command a room. The book provides frame-by-frame analysis of the Trump-Biden debate, contrasting Biden’s shuffling entrance with Trump’s calculated positioning—reminiscent of a WWE wrestler commanding the crowd before entering the ring.
“Americans like strong. They will choose strong and wrong over weak and right,” Karl noted, quoting former President Bill Clinton while describing how Trump dominated the debate before a single question was asked.
The book’s title, “Retribution,” reflects what Karl identifies as the central motivation of Trump’s campaign. Karl contends the numerous prosecutions against Trump were instrumental in fueling his political resurrection.
Looking ahead, Karl discussed the future of the GOP post-Trump and whether any Republican will be able to harness MAGA’s enthusiasm for Trump.
Karl’s goal with “Retribution” was straightforward: to document the most important election of our lifetime while telling the story of “a hell of a campaign” for history.
